sacred pollux and sacred leonis's effects stack?

im probably very stupid with this but i need to ask, can the effects pollux and leonis stack?


what i mean is, can you summon pollux to then normal leo. could you then use leo's effect to normal another sacred or does the normal summoning of sacreds cap at 2 because of how the cards are read?


their effs for clarification.

pollux:
One time during the turn this card is Normal Summoned, you can Normal Summon 1 "The Sacred" monster in addition to your Normal Summon or Set.

leonis:
During your Main Phase: You can Normal Summon 1 "The Sacred" monster in addition to your Normal Summon or Set. This effect can only be used once per turn.

is The Sacred like Komachi's ruling?

Effects that give an extra Normal Summon do not stack because you already ad had an extra normal summon. So no, the don't.

you can stack one leonis with one pollux, but not two leonis or two pollux.

Joenen wrote:you can stack one leonis with one pollux, but not two leonis or two pollux.

No, because you've already Normal Summoned an Extra monster for that turn. By what I remember you don't get stacks even with different cards that add a normal summon.

The whole reason Komachi doesn't work is because you've already Normal Summoned an extra Karakuri monster so you've used up both of the effects in one shot. I don't know about Komachi stacking with Pollux, but Pollux and Leonis will not stack.

you can use single 224, swap frog and/or double summon and gaining the benefit of each effect as they only prevent the same effect to be used more than once.
the exception is like double summon and chain summoning that konami ruled you can only gain up to 3.

By the current text I don't think pollux and leonis are giving the same effect, so you can stack 1 pollux and 1 leonis.

poemi wrote:you can use single 224, swap frog and/or double summon and get the benefit of each effect as they only prevent the same effect to be used more than once.
the exception is like double summon and chain summoning that konami ruled you can only gain up to 3.

By the current text I don't think pollux and leonis are giving the same effect, so you can stack 1 pollux and 1 leonis.

Leonis summons the same monsters Pollux summons. The only difference in their effects is the condition under when it can be used.

But you're applying the effect one by one, because they're different effects. When you want to use the extra summon, you choose whose effect you want to apply for that summon.

I don't think that because of both cards giving the opportunity for extra summoning the same named monster means that they're putting the same condition nor having the same effect.

poemi wrote:But you're applying the effect one by one, because they're different effects. When you want to use the extra summon, you choose whose effect you want to apply for that summon.

I don't think that because of both cards giving the opportunity for extra summoning the same named monster means that they're putting the same condition nor having the same effect.

If you activate 1, you've summoned an extra "Sacred" monster that turn. That's how it's been ruled. Just because you have 2 effects to activate doesn't mean they stack.

Both effects only allow you to summon 1 extra "Sacred" monster. Once you summon an extra "Sacred" monster, you've used that 1 summon. They don't stack.

And with your logic you can use Pollux and Pollux because you choose whose effect to apply for that summon.

What about ultimate offering?

Karakuri911 wrote:What about ultimate offering?

I'm giving the ruling given by Konami and applying it. That's all I can say. Ultimate Offering is the exception, not the rule.

Multiple pollux or multiple leonis isn't stacking as they're having the exactly same effect. However a pollux effect is a pollux effect, it not a leonis effect, so they don't interfere each other (just like swap frog and 224). The case that the monster that both pollux and leonis allowed to extra summon is having the same name is irrelevant.
Unless konami release any ruling that said otherwise just like double summon vs chain summoning.

Ultimate offering is different, rather than giving an opportunity to do an extra summon like double summon (you don't have to use it if you don't want). Ultimate offering is actually summoning the monster when the effect resolved. So it treated as a different entity.

It's not that they can't stack is that they are giving you the same thing... 1 extra in addition to your normal summon... So both say, normal summon 1 in addition to your normal summon... Ummm hard to put it into words, but it's like ... If your boss said you could have 1 extra paycheck in addition to the one you're getting this week already... Even if another admin at your work place said you can have an extra 1 in addition, it's still just 1 in addition ... Can't be more than 1.

poemi wrote:Multiple pollux or multiple leonis isn't stacking as they're having the exactly same effect. However a pollux effect is a pollux effect, it not a leonis effect, so they don't interfere each other (just like swap frog and 224). The case that the monster that both pollux and leonis allowed to extra summon is having the same name is irrelevant.
Unless konami release any ruling that said otherwise just like double summon vs chain summoning.

It doesn't matter if they're the exact same effect. Like Luz said, they both give you the same opportunity. Swap Frog and Ninishi don't stack because Swap lets you summon a "Frog" monster and Ninishi lets you summon a "Karakuri" monster. If you summon a Frog with swaps effect, you haven't used your extra summon for a Karakuri yet.

I physically went to test swap frog and double summon on WC2011 using the Duel Puzzle feature.

you can use multiple effects that grant extra normal summons a turn. Two double summons will not give you two extra normal summons. Two swap frogs will not give you multiple normal summons of frogs.

but you can use double summon and swap frog to gain two normal summons in addition to your regular normal summon, to normal summon three times in one turn.

so i would say you can use leonis and pollux effects in the same turn. you just can't use two pollux, or two leonis. but you mmay stack one each.

.

Then why don't Chain Summoning and Double Summon stack?

The answer can be one of two things.

BKSS

or because of chain summoning working or being ruled in an arbitrary manner.

I just experimented with the game on WC's duel puzzle mode, and here's what i did.

1 Normal summon swap. I use its effect addig it back to my hand as its cost.
2. chained chain Detonation as chain link 2
3. chained chain summoning as chain link 3.
chain resolves, I've normal summoned once this turn with swap frog.

I normal swap again. (2nd normal), I normal fishborg blaster ( 3rd normal) then i normal treeborn frog (4th normal, thanks to swap frog's effect).

I activated double summon, but i could not gain another normal summon due to chain summoning (where as before, i could use it)

so i could not tribute summon my in hand dark magician.

From this i can conclude that chain summoning and double summon will work with swap frog. Chain summoning will not work with double summon.

Personally, I smell BKSS on the chain summoning vs. double summon, but anyways, so far I don't see a reason for leonis and pollux to not work together.

Email konami about it, until then, we go with it does not stack
And this thread won't be marked as solved

What the heck is "will won't be"?

just an ocg update, while a specific leonis vs. pollux is unavailab.e, there's a recent ruling on leonis, komachi, and general grunard.

Q: If you control Sacred Leonis, General Grunard of the Ice Barrier and Karakuri Komachi mdl 224 “Ninishi”, can you Normal Summon a "Sacred", "Ice Barrier" and "Karakuri" Monster with their respective effects during the same turn in addition to your Normal Summon?
A: For monsters that allow you to Normal Summon a monster in addition to your Normal Summon, even if you control Sacred Leonis, General Grunard of the Ice Barrier and Karakuri Komachi mdl 224 “Ninishi”, you can only apply the effect of 1 of them.
For example, if you apply the effect of Sacred Leonis, you cannot apply the effect of General Grunard of the Ice Barrier or Karakuri Komachi mdl 224 “Ninishi”.

Note that pollux and leonis are functionally different. Leonis requires that it must be face up on the field etc. for its effect to be used. When Pollux is summoned however, pollux no longer cares if its face up on the field or not. Pollux works like dodger dragon and leonis works like komachi etc.

Basically, we still need a clarification from konami about Pollux and leonis.

Sacred Pollux
Ｑ： 《二重召喚》とこのカードで、１ ターンに合計３回の通常召喚は可能ですか？
Ａ：可能です。 （11/10/17）

You can normal summon 3 monsters if you activate Double Summon the turn you summon this card


Sacred Leonis
Ｑ： 《セイクリッド・ポルクス》の効果と合わせて、 セイクリッドを１ ターンに３回通常召喚できますか？
Ａ：できません。 どちらかの効果を適用した場合、もう片方の効果は適用できません。 (12/01/25)

You cannot apply the effect of Sacred Pollux if you already summoned this card


...

The issue here is that the effects are identical.

All examples of Komachi + Sacred or Frog + Double Summon are void.

The Double Summon + Chain Summon makes a good point...

I would personally say they stacked, but I don't honestly think they do. (Don't forget Komachi doesn't stack -Because it says it doesn't-.)

It seems that the rules of normal summoning depend on the kind of effect used. Continuous effects don't stack, while lingering effects can stack unless the card specifies it can't (Double Summon) (I wonder if how you order the effects also matters), and ignition-like effects (Ultimate Offering) don't stack for the same reason Solemn Judgment can't negate Monster Reborn.

did you just say solem judgement cant be used to negate the spell monster reborn?

I meant the summon... since we're talking about summons here...

T3RCX wrote:I meant the summon... since we're talking about summons here...

Should've used Zombie Master as an example.

I undestand his way...

Both monsters (polluc and leonis) allow you normal summon a "The Sacred" monster 1 extra time in adction of the turn normal summon. So if you summon both you can have only 1 extra summon, becose you have only 1 turn normal summon