Divine Wind Genex OTK is it legal or not? does it miss the timing?

Here's the Combo,

1. Play Divine Wind of Mist Valley
2. Normal summon Reborn Tengu
3. Use Ally Genex Birdman to return Tengu to hand, special summon another Tengu and special summon [YGOCARD]Genex Blastfan[/YGOCARD] with Divine Wind, search for another Birdman with Blastfan.
4. Synchro Birdman and Blastfan for [YGOCARD]Ancient Fairy Dragon[/YGOCARD], activate its effect to search for another Divine Wind, play it.
5. Use Ally Genex Birdman to return Tengu to hand, special summon THIRD Tengu and special summon [YGOCARD]Genex Blastfan[/YGOCARD] with Divine Wind, search for Birdman with Blastfan.
6. Synchro summon the Blastfan with SECOND Birdman for AFD, activate its effect and play another Divine Wind.
7. Use third Birdman to return third Tengu to hand, special summon THIRD Blastfan with Divine Wind, getting R-Genex Oracle, special summon it with its effect.
8. Synchro AFD and Oracle for Genex Ally Axel
1600 + 1900 + 2100 + 2800 = game

Just like to ask our resident ruling experts, if it's legal or not, that way we would know if faced against it in an actual tournament, saw a few of it already at Dueling Network, and it's played as if there's no timing issues involved,

Just like to know the facts, and where does it exactly miss the timing, if there's one,

Thank You Very Much!! /no1

I think this is legit

Play Divine Wind of Mist Valley

Normal summon Reborn Tengu

Use Ally Genex Birdman to return Tengu to hand,
Divine Wind of Mist Valley and Reborn Tengu activates and forms a chain, at this point i think you can choose which effect you would place on chain link 1, and naturally you would put divine wind on ch1, tengu on ch2...

chain resolves, another tengu is summoned, divine wind special summons blastfan, since summoning blastfan was the last thing to happen then you dont miss the timing. continue until gg...

so i think you will only miss the timing if you switch the order of tengu and divine wind on that part... otherwise its legit. enjoy your 3-card otk kthxbai '')/

you're wrong, Tengu must be chain 1 because it is mandatory, not optional! Every mandatory effect must go first! So Blastfan will miss the timing!

The above post is incorrect.

which one?

Here is how the matter works.

Returning Tengu to the hand to Summon Birdman triggers both Tengu's mandatory Trigger Effect and Divine Wind's optional Trigger Effect.

Specifically, Tengu and Wind BOTH trigger at the exact moment the monster is returned. (Triggering a Trigger Effect is NOT the same thing as activating it - triggering it is what you do to make it okay to activate.)

But at that exact moment, Tengu and Wind can't be activated because you're already busy - you're currently activating Birdman's Ignition Effect.

Tengu's effect specifies that it activates "when" triggered. This means it has a timing - and that timing can be missed.

Tengu's effect is also mandatory, which means you HAVE to activate it if it is triggered. You don't have a choice. So, although Tengu's effect misses its timing when you return it to activate Birdman, you can still activate Tengu. You just have to wait to activate it. (Tributing Sangan to summon a Monarch works the same way.)

Divine Wind's effect specifies that it activates "if" triggered - not "when" triggered. This means it has no specific timing, and by default will be happy to wait to activate at the next legal moment, whenever that moment is. It isn't picky about when it activates, and as a result, it has no specific "timing" - meaning that "missing the timing" isn't possible with it because it doesn't have a "timing".

Divine Wind's effect is also optional. Now, if it had a timing and were optional, missing that timing would mean that you gave up the right to activate Divine Wind. But because Divine Wind has no specific timing to miss, you aren't forced to decide whether or not you're going to activate it until you're legally capable of making a yes-or-no decision without other game rules forcing you to answer "no".

So, Tengu misses its timing because of Birdman, but because its effect is mandatory, it doesn't care and is gonna activate anyway. Divine Wind is optional but doesn't have a timing, so it'll happily wait until you're finished handling Birdman.

Birdman is handled.

Both Tengu and Divine Wind want to activate after Birdman is handled. Tengu and Wind were triggered at the same time, so we handle this via SEGOC.

Tengu's effect is placed onto the Chain before Wind's, because Tengu's is mandatory and Wind's isn't.





The key to this incident isn't just SEGOC; it's also knowing that it is possible for several Trigger Effects that were triggered at different times to want to activate at the same time.

A more fundamental rule than SEGOC is the rule that Trigger Effects triggered earliest always go onto the Chain first. (When you Tribute Sangan to Tribute Summon Thestalos, Sangan will ALWAYS be Chain Link 1 - you don't have a choice!)

SEGOC as a rule applies ONLY to Trigger Effects that were Triggered at the same time AND want to activate at the same time. (When you Tribute Sangan to Tribute Summon Thestalos while a player controls Stumbling, Sangan is not part of handling the SEGOC rule; but Thestalos and Stumbling both are. Sangan was triggered BEFORE both of the others; the others were triggered at the same time.)

BlackwingRa wrote:which one?

Kaust's. Didn't see yours.

agrees with Atem, my bad

Pharaoh Atem wrote:

BlackwingRa wrote:which one?

Kaust's. Didn't see yours.

hurtful!

GRIMLOCK wrote:Here's the Combo,

1. Play Divine Wind of Mist Valley
2. Normal summon Reborn Tengu
3. Use Ally Genex Birdman to return Tengu to hand, special summon another Tengu and special summon [YGOCARD]Genex Blastfan[/YGOCARD] with Divine Wind, search for another Birdman with Blastfan.
4. Synchro Birdman and Blastfan for [YGOCARD]Ancient Fairy Dragon[/YGOCARD], activate its effect to search for another Divine Wind, play it.
5. Use Ally Genex Birdman to return Tengu to hand, special summon THIRD Tengu and special summon [YGOCARD]Genex Blastfan[/YGOCARD] with Divine Wind, search for Birdman with Blastfan.
6. Synchro summon the Blastfan with SECOND Birdman for AFD, activate its effect and play another Divine Wind.
7. Use third Birdman to return third Tengu to hand, special summon THIRD Blastfan with Divine Wind, getting R-Genex Oracle, special summon it with its effect.
8. Synchro AFD and Oracle for Genex Ally Axel
1600 + 1900 + 2100 + 2800 = game

Thank You Very Much!! /no1

Actually, axel has 2600 atk not 2800,
not changing the fact that its still an OTK tough xD
but yes, it does not miss the timing,
cz "If ... you can" Divine Wind and Tengu mandatory eff will never miss the timing, and nothing wrong with blastfan here

the one missing the timing is blastfan.
he is special summoned at chainlink 2, while the last event happening is tengu being summoned.

Hyaweh★kawa wrote:the one missing the timing is blastfan.
he is special summoned at chainlink 2, while the last event happening is tengu being summoned.

Or better yet, the last thing to happen is not Blastfan being special summoned.

thought that last thing was blasfan special summoned,
But its true that if divine wind at chain 2, so blasfan miss timing,

Remember, the only reason Blastfan's effect cannot be activated here isn't because "Blastfan's effect misses the timing".

Effects do not miss timing.

Players miss timing.

Specifically, players miss timing because something else in the game prevents them from not missing said timing.