Priority and Chains Question

I was dueling online earlier. My opponent had a full field of monsters. I activated "Monster Reborn" to Special Summon "Dark Magician Girl" from my Graveyard. I had "Sage's Stone" in my hand, he had "Torrential Tribute" face-down.

So what happened was this. I revived "Dark Magician Girl" and activated "Sage's Stone". Player B (as he shall be known) activated "Torrential Tribute", and had every right to chain it to "Sage's Stone" as a summon was the last action to resolve on the field. I would have expected "Torrential Tribute" to destroy all monsters, then for "Sage's Stone" to Special Summon 1 "Dark Magician" (so I could attack for game). "Sage's Stone" only requires "Dark Magician Girl" to be on the field during activation, by the way, so her being destroyed would have no effect.

Player B, however, claimed that I could not use "Sage's Stone" because summoning a monster automatically passes Priority to the opponent. Yugioh Wikia's page on Priority blatantly contradicts this, with the classic example of "Chaos Sorcerer" getting to put his effect as Chain Link 1. Player B also claimed that he could "chain to the summoning of Dark Magician Girl", despite the fact that a summon does not start a chain. Only card effects can start chains. He also said that "Torrential Tribute" would just destroy "Dark Magician" anyway, and seemed not to factor the chain into account here. When I got a Mod to rule, the Mod ruled in his favour. As there were no other Mods to appeal the ruling to, I ended up losing the game and being harassed and insulted by Player B in the chat for the next ten minutes (which I regrettably did not have the chance to report).

I was under the impression that my knowledge of the rules in this area was sound. Am I mistaken, or was that Mod just a bit dim?

CL1 Sage's Stone
CL2 Torrential
Resolve Backwards
Torrential destroys everything
Sages Stone summons DM.
I'm 99.9% sure this is what happens

Kraziub wrote:
I'm 99.9% sure this is what happens

And I'm sure 100% that you are incorrect.

@Occultdude17: When a monster is summoned, only Ignition Effect (on TCG only), Trigger Effect and Spell Speed 2 or more effects can be actived to respond that summon. Sage Stone is a Normal Spell, you cannot immediatelly active it after the monster is summoned.

It's 2AM give me a break srsly.

I don't think you can use spell on mosnter summoning.

Both player B and Mods are correct
(and yeah 120% Kraziub is incorrect)

kangtuji wrote:I don't think you can use spell on mosnter summoning.

Both player B and Mods are correct
(and yeah 120% Kraziub is incorrect)

Can you cite a source? I've been unable to find anything on the subject in all the obvious place.

ryderjj89 wrote:Monster Reborn
Dark Magician Girl
Torrential Tribute must be activated now
Sage's Stone can't be activated if Torrential is activated. If they pass and let you use Sage's Stone on Dark Magician, they can then activate Torrential and both monsters would be destroyed.

The simple fact that Sage's Stone is not a quick-play spell is enough to explain why you can't activate and resolve Sage's Stone before Torrential Tribute resolves if they activate it.

But wouldn't last action to resolve on the field still be the summoning of a monster? I don't understand why an Ignition Effect like "Chaos Sorcerer" works, but another Spell Speed 1 card like "Sage's Stone" doesn't. It seems arbitrary.

Occultdude17 wrote:

Can you cite a source? I've been unable to find anything on the subject in all the obvious place.

Like I said, in "summon response window" only Ignition Effect, Trigger Effect and Spell Speed 2 or more effect can be actived. Sage's Stone has Spell Speed 1, it cannot be actived to response anything. Like you cannot summon a Tuner and immediately use it for Synchro Summon, before your opponent can active his Trap Hole. (And I hope you know what is Spell Speed).

Occultdude17 wrote:

But wouldn't last action to resolve on the field still be the summoning of a monster? I don't understand why an Ignition Effect like "Chaos Sorcerer" works, but another Spell Speed 1 card like "Sage's Stone" doesn't. It seems arbitrary.

Because that is an exception, and it was removed from OCG (Japanese YGO!)

Magicknight94 wrote:

Occultdude17 wrote:

Can you cite a source? I've been unable to find anything on the subject in all the obvious place.

Like I said, in "summon response window" only Ignition Effect, Trigger Effect and Spell Speed 2 or more effect can be actived. Sage's Stone has Spell Speed 1, it cannot be actived to response anything. Like you cannot summon a Tuner and immediately use it for Synchro Summon, before your opponent can active his Trap Hole. (And I hope you know what is Spell Speed).

Occultdude17 wrote:

But wouldn't last action to resolve on the field still be the summoning of a monster? I don't understand why an Ignition Effect like "Chaos Sorcerer" works, but another Spell Speed 1 card like "Sage's Stone" doesn't. It seems arbitrary.

Because that is an exception, and it was removed from OCG (Japanese YGO!)

It's a strange exception, as Chaos Sorcerer wouldn't be responding to anything, would it? You'd have to start a whole new set of events by activating its effect.

This is all confusing. Just to clarify, what are the rules surrounding the "summon response window" and is there any official-ish webpage on it?

Occultdude17 wrote:

It's a strange exception, as Chaos Sorcerer wouldn't be responding to anything, would it? You'd have to start a whole new set of events by activating its effect.

This is all confusing. Just to clarify, what are the rules surrounding the "summon response window" and is there any official-ish webpage on it?

That why they remove it from OCG.

Just Google it, and will see.

What happen to ignition with cost like elementah hero prisma ?

And Trigger effect like Elemental Hero startos

Actually Ignition Effect is Spell Speed 1, but with priority, it is faster than Normal Spell Cards (you can call it Spell Speed 1.5 for fun). And for Ignition Effects that have cost, you pay the cost before your opponent can chain anything if you activate the effect. Trigger Effects don't need priority, so priority or not, Stratos will activate its effect if not miss time or negate summon.

Ignition effects are in no way faster than other spell speed 1 effects. It was only ruled, way back in the days, that they can be activated in response to a summon. Why so, nobody knows. But deal with it, it is like that. If you want a source... well, you might find something in the rulebook I presume

Konami OCG realized that it is in no way logical and so removed that. You are no longer able to activate Ignition effects there. Konami TCG didn't remove it, for whatever reason. Nobody knows.

For further information about priority read the sticky: http://forum.duelingnetwork.com/t660-ruling-101-priority

Goddess nX wrote:both Ryder and dest hit it on the head perfectly. If you don't have anymore questions then a judge can put this topic as solved and promptly lock it.

Like Goddess said, Dest got it right.
Solved

the only problem i had with prio for igntion effect are the one who think they can stop mandatory effects with prio (when i have king tiger and they summon a monster tiger can kill like lonefire they try to stop tiger by calling prio) or the ones who misplay by using sangan as material for brionac and want to be able to activate brio effect before i BTH it

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